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Plot-holes
07-04-2011, 11:47 AM (This post was last modified: 07-04-2011 12:42 PM by BravoNine.)
Post: #158
RE: Plot-holes
(07-04-2011 11:18 AM)molecatcher Wrote:  If every tv series was over analysed then holes would be found and that's a fact.

As many of us have said before, we are not trying to nitpick about everything that wasn't done right. Fictional dramas are always going to have plot holes, but when the whole central storyline is based and founded upon one giant plot hole that is never explained and quickly glossed over, the rest of those insignificant little ones that never mattered starts to become so much more clear and more irritating.

Spooks have had plenty of plot holes from all their series, but people have gotten over it because the central storyline was done well, so people accepted those little plot holes of just Ros and Lucas saving the world by themselves or the magically fast car rides from point A to point B. But when the logical foundations of an important central storyline doesn't even stand up to scrutiny and is never explained, then THAT becomes a BIG issue, and THAT makes all those little holes feel like giant leaks.

(07-04-2011 11:18 AM)molecatcher Wrote:  I may be in a minority here as someone who just sits back to enjoy the journey, expect the unexpected and revel in the amazing drama that is Spooks but I think you will find over 5 million viewers out there do much the same as me.

I sit back and enjoy journeys on plenty of shows, I don't sit around and nitpick everything of a show that I watch. As a big science fiction lover, I know more than most when it comes to facing the unexpected and just go with the storyline. But what I will not accept is writers short-changing their characters so they can go out in a shock and awe storylines done for ratings and not for a good story.

You can expect the unexpected and revel in amazing drama, but there is a fine line between good unexpected drama and over-the-top-melodrama with no logical base. You cannot just toss out an idea and think it's so cool and then put no logical base or explanation, any writer should know that. Writing a good story is about exploring the emotional core and a logical foundation, a story without both is unbalanced and simply doesn't work. Lucas's story may have an interesting emotional connection, but the 180 character flip was given no strong logical foundation, how he got into MI5 was never explained, how he did a lot of things were never explained, but we are just suppose to go with it and believe that the agent who spent 8 years in Russia as a prisoner for his country, a person who would give his life for his people and his team, would in one moment become this selfish coward and bastard who would give up the lives of millions of people just to have the love of a woman from 15 years ago?

There may have been an emotional struggle, but the writers never again explained it properly just like they never bothered to explain how John Bateman was able to bypass all their securities. Richard Armitage and the other actors may have brought so much meaning and emotion to the scenes, but there is only so much an actor can do to save a story that is not properly written and explained.

There was no depth and no logic to this story, so many things never explained but we are just suppose to believe in this 180 flip from good agent to selfish weakling.

I'm sorry but even with my usual habit of just enjoy my show and come along for the ride, I cannot stand blatant character changes that is not explained. I expect to see these kind of writings on daytime soap operas, not on a great primetime drama like Spooks. It's amateur writing, and I expect better from Spooks.

And while it is nice to just sit there and enjoy everything and be happy, if we are just sitting around like mindless mules, not giving any comment or criticism, how will these writers ever improve? Wouldn't that be a great disservice that we are doing to the show as the viewers? What's the point of watching if we don't express our opinions as they are but rather just sit around and nod along like everything's fine?

If we keep letting the writers get away with whatever story they want and not be a good sounding board for them, how will they improve? How will they be able to be better at anything if we just nod and thumbs up everything they do? A good audience loves the show but also knows to criticize and critique it when it does wrong, not just go along with whatever the writers put down.

This Lucas story simply lacks the strong foundation to hold it together, and because of that crumbling foundation, it makes the whole story look full of holes. These writers have already talked in commentaries about how they didn't even bother to figure out proper explanations because they just thought this story was cool and that was what mattered. I'm sorry, but no matter what, THAT is not what a good writer does. And it's that obnoxious attitude that I will not stand for.

I came to watch Spooks for quality entertainment, I expect the best, I'm not sitting here watching writers who think that what matters for a story is to be exciting and cool rather than be planned out well with a good solid explanation. And if this is where Spooks wants to go, then I will not go with it.

And finally, I don't see why I should conform to the views of 5 million other people just because they think one way. I am my own person with my own mind. This series lacked the quality of a great character arc and as a writer myself, I will always be disappointed in what they chose to do with the story when there are so many other viable and equally intelligent solutions.

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Messages In This Thread
Plot-holes - Byatil - 20-01-2011, 08:00 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Saerwen - 20-01-2011, 11:47 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Belle - 21-01-2011, 09:40 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Jackk14 - 18-04-2011, 11:46 PM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 19-04-2011, 10:05 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Jackk14 - 20-04-2011, 12:49 AM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 22-04-2011, 10:08 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 21-01-2011, 11:53 AM
RE: Plot-holes - xzibit_m - 21-01-2011, 03:13 PM
RE: Plot-holes - NightOwl - 21-01-2011, 06:20 PM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 22-01-2011, 03:37 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Tea Lady - 22-01-2011, 03:59 PM
RE: Plot-holes - NightOwl - 23-01-2011, 02:46 AM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 22-01-2011, 05:48 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 22-01-2011, 07:05 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Saerwen - 23-01-2011, 01:52 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 23-01-2011, 06:58 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 23-01-2011, 07:24 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 23-01-2011, 09:13 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 23-01-2011, 09:36 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 23-01-2011, 10:04 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 23-01-2011, 11:14 PM
RE: Plot-holes - George - 27-01-2011, 10:04 PM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 23-01-2011, 10:25 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 25-01-2011, 09:29 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 23-01-2011, 11:23 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 24-01-2011, 12:24 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 24-01-2011, 01:23 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 24-01-2011, 03:06 PM
RE: Plot-holes - LINDA - 24-01-2011, 05:15 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 24-01-2011, 05:36 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 25-01-2011, 12:27 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 25-01-2011, 01:18 AM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 25-01-2011, 01:39 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 25-01-2011, 02:00 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Nixie - 27-03-2011, 03:00 AM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 04-04-2011, 03:07 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Nixie - 04-04-2011, 11:56 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 25-01-2011, 02:30 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 25-01-2011, 12:45 PM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 26-01-2011, 12:25 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 26-01-2011, 12:30 AM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 26-01-2011, 12:36 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 26-01-2011, 12:50 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 26-01-2011, 12:55 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 26-01-2011, 12:19 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 26-01-2011, 12:33 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 26-01-2011, 12:45 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 26-01-2011, 01:05 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 26-01-2011, 01:24 PM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 26-01-2011, 02:38 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Saerwen - 26-01-2011, 01:09 AM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 26-01-2011, 01:55 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 26-01-2011, 03:27 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Saerwen - 26-01-2011, 02:47 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 26-01-2011, 03:28 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 26-01-2011, 03:39 AM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 26-01-2011, 08:50 AM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 26-01-2011, 11:37 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 26-01-2011, 02:29 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 26-01-2011, 02:31 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 26-01-2011, 02:38 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 26-01-2011, 08:18 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Saerwen - 26-01-2011, 09:39 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 27-01-2011, 02:40 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 27-01-2011, 03:53 PM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 28-01-2011, 09:14 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 28-01-2011, 09:36 AM
RE: Plot-holes - Saerwen - 27-01-2011, 10:42 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 27-01-2011, 10:57 PM
RE: Plot-holes - George - 28-01-2011, 04:16 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 28-01-2011, 04:28 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 28-01-2011, 05:02 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 28-01-2011, 07:53 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 28-01-2011, 09:57 PM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 28-01-2011, 09:57 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 28-01-2011, 12:00 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 28-01-2011, 10:57 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 28-01-2011, 11:15 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 28-01-2011, 11:16 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 28-01-2011, 11:42 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 28-01-2011, 11:43 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 29-01-2011, 12:53 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 29-01-2011, 01:02 AM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 29-01-2011, 01:05 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 29-01-2011, 01:07 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 29-01-2011, 07:08 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 29-01-2011, 07:12 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 03-03-2011, 12:55 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 03-03-2011, 12:58 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 03-03-2011, 01:13 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 03-03-2011, 01:16 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 03-03-2011, 01:22 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Saerwen - 03-03-2011, 02:11 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 03-03-2011, 02:50 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 03-03-2011, 07:13 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 04-03-2011, 02:15 PM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 04-03-2011, 11:55 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 05-03-2011, 12:04 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 04-03-2011, 09:03 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 04-03-2011, 09:17 PM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-03-2011, 05:47 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 07-03-2011, 05:53 AM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-03-2011, 06:15 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 07-03-2011, 06:25 AM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-03-2011, 06:32 AM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 07-03-2011, 11:21 AM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-03-2011, 11:58 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 07-03-2011, 07:13 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 07-03-2011, 10:15 AM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 08-03-2011, 10:05 PM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-03-2011, 10:24 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 07-03-2011, 07:48 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 13-03-2011, 05:29 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 13-03-2011, 05:53 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 13-03-2011, 06:13 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 13-03-2011, 06:41 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 13-03-2011, 10:09 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 13-03-2011, 10:28 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 13-03-2011, 10:59 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 14-03-2011, 12:14 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 14-03-2011, 01:49 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 14-03-2011, 02:36 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 14-03-2011, 03:27 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 14-03-2011, 02:40 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 14-03-2011, 05:06 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Belle - 14-03-2011, 04:20 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 15-03-2011, 02:09 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 15-03-2011, 10:19 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 15-03-2011, 10:28 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 15-03-2011, 10:33 PM
RE: Plot-holes - A Cousin - 15-03-2011, 10:49 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 15-03-2011, 10:58 PM
RE: Plot-holes - A Cousin - 16-03-2011, 02:39 PM
RE: Plot-holes - WhiteSwan - 15-03-2011, 11:55 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 16-03-2011, 06:00 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 16-03-2011, 12:11 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 16-03-2011, 04:39 AM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 16-03-2011, 08:57 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 16-03-2011, 09:47 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 16-03-2011, 10:49 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 16-03-2011, 11:06 AM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 16-03-2011, 12:50 PM
RE: Plot-holes - NightOwl - 16-03-2011, 01:03 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 16-03-2011, 02:25 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 17-03-2011, 02:26 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 19-03-2011, 12:30 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 19-03-2011, 02:18 AM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 19-03-2011, 06:54 PM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 21-03-2011, 12:10 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 19-03-2011, 09:35 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 21-03-2011, 12:25 PM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 21-03-2011, 02:00 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 21-03-2011, 02:36 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 21-03-2011, 06:39 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 04-04-2011, 09:07 PM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 04-04-2011, 09:30 PM
RE: Plot-holes - binkie - 04-04-2011, 10:18 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 04-04-2011, 09:59 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 05-04-2011, 11:57 AM
RE: Plot-holes - molecatcher - 07-04-2011, 11:18 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 07-04-2011 11:47 AM
RE: Plot-holes - NightOwl - 07-04-2011, 01:05 PM
RE: Plot-holes - molecatcher - 07-04-2011, 07:02 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 07-04-2011, 09:45 PM
RE: Plot-holes - molecatcher - 11-04-2011, 11:18 AM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-04-2011, 12:04 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 07-04-2011, 12:31 PM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-04-2011, 12:54 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Byatil - 07-04-2011, 12:59 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 07-04-2011, 01:00 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 07-04-2011, 01:43 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Silktie - 07-04-2011, 03:40 PM
RE: Plot-holes - xRuthx - 07-04-2011, 10:02 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 08-04-2011, 01:13 PM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 08-04-2011, 05:12 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 11-04-2011, 03:29 PM
RE: Plot-holes - molecatcher - 14-04-2011, 12:23 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 14-04-2011, 12:43 PM
RE: Plot-holes - A Cousin - 14-04-2011, 03:06 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 14-04-2011, 04:47 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 14-04-2011, 03:35 PM
RE: Plot-holes - BoHenley - 08-05-2011, 12:21 AM
RE: Plot-holes - BravoNine - 09-05-2011, 01:46 PM
RE: Plot-holes - HellsBells - 09-05-2011, 01:41 PM
RE: Plot-holes - Neraul - 01-02-2012, 04:10 AM
RE: Plot-holes - A Cousin - 01-02-2012, 03:01 PM
RE: Plot-holes - penfold - 01-02-2012, 03:16 PM

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