Series 9 Episode 7 discussion

[Apicius]

I'm new to all of this but love spooks. Finished the long haul of catching up with all series culminating in watching S9 Episode 7 tonight. WOW! My heart is still racing.

You may have covered this elsewhere but what are people's thoughts about Albany? Obviously serious stuff what with Malcolm's behaviour. (So glad Malcolm is ok!)

[GuyBurgess]

Hi All.... been reading the boards for a while now and opted to "come out of the closet", so to speak!!!
This has been one of the best series so far for me, so many twists and turns and this weeks episode really was quite gripping.
My own theories on the Lucas/John, Vaughan, Albany, Dakar story???

Well, Harry obviously has a bee in his bonnet about Dakar happening "on his watch", and I reckon both he and Malcolm had been working on the same project and was trusted by Harry on it.
Did "John" already work for MI5, and was Harry using him to get to Vaughan? Did Harry know Vaughan was just a pawn in a much murkier pond?
The real Lucas North confessed that he was being employed by MI5, which is something they would avoid telling anyone (and did you see how much booze he was quaffing!!!). Anyone with a problem of talking when drunk would not be invited into the Service surely? Had Harry set up the real Lucas so that John could do away with him and take his place in order to get close to Vaughan and whoever was setting up the bombing? Is this animosity which is building up between Harry and Lucas/John just a smoke screen to flush out the real brain behind the bombing? Did Harry set up Lucas/John to get sent to a Russian prison for 8 years as part of a deep cover?
Seems to me that Albany is the file Harry has been building up to track down the Mastermind behind the bombing and that Lucas/John, Vaughan and the Dakar bombing are what Albany is really all about.

Please feel free to shoot me down in the biggest pile of poo you can get your hands on if you feel then need!!!!!

[femaleBertieWooster]

(04-11-2010 09:58 PM)WhiteSwan Wrote:  why on earth would someone who apparantly is a killer, someone without any conscience, someone who just blew up the British embassay (why he did it would be one more question) and then murdered his friend to get his passport join MI5? I mean come on, he had the passport, so he managed to leave the country - he could have gone anywhere, he could even have gone back to his old life (with the danger of being blackmailed by Vaughn, but as it is that happened anyway). Would anyone who's on the run and who's trying to cover his tracks join MI5? Is this a well-known safe-haven for criminals?

Good, that is to say Awesome point. In a word,

Spoiler: show

Vaughn.

[BravoNine]

I thought this was an interesting thing to mention, I was just watching a US spy show called Nikita, and the character says that line that I thought was fitting for the current Lucas/John storyline, she said that something to the effect of how spies wear masks, and sometimes they wear them for so long that they start to become the masks they wear.

Part of me wonders if that's what happened to John, that he took over the identity of Lucas North and immersed himself so deeply into believing this cover that he slowly became Lucas North and forget the past until Vaughn returned.

It really makes me wonder if John/Lucas had any mental problems.

[tastiger]

Well, finally got to watch this episode. I did read some of the comments earlier in the week....and was hoping it wasn't as bad for Lucas as it sounded....but sorry to say RA is going out in a blaze no doubt about it. I can't see any redemption for what he has done in the past so its just a matter of how they bring the character of Lucas/John to an end. I suspect that he will have a turning point when he is face to face with Harry. I believed him when he said that the 8 years in prison was deserved and that he put his life on the line willingly for MI5.

I think that his respect for Harry will be his weakness and his downfall. I am not impressed by the character, Maya. Not much substance there. Ruth was great as usual. I didn't think her actions with the assassin was over the top. He was beating her up and she was fighting for her life. Shooting him was almost like payback for the killing of her husband. I felt so sad when she told Harry she felt fine and just wanted to go back to work. Maybe that's what happens when you are around death all the time...you become numb...for self preservation.

This episode really was a roller coaster ride! I love RA and he was just riveting. When they showed the actual flashback with Vaughn at the end I felt sick and exhausted. This will be the most "explosive" ending for a major character of Spooks....and not in a brave or honorable way. I was happy to read that there would be a series 10, not ever imagining that
RA would not be a part of it. Baring a sensational twist I can't see that happening....Richard, you will be missed!

[FATBOY]

(04-11-2010 11:30 PM)GuyBurgess Wrote:  ... The real Lucas North confessed that he was being employed by MI5, which is something they would avoid telling anyone (and did you see how much booze he was quaffing!!!). Anyone with a problem of talking when drunk would not be invited into the Service surely? ...

yes and not to mention the dodgy cigarettes

[JHyde]

I am sorry that Maya hasn't been made more of. The character has ended up one dimensional and that's disappointing given what she stands for in Lucas' eyes.

Then again, I would much rather prefer the moments between the Grid team than have Maya get soulful moments.

[FATBOY]

(05-11-2010 09:50 AM)JHyde Wrote:  I am sorry that Maya hasn't been made more of. The character has ended up one dimensional and that's disappointing given what she stands for in Lucas' eyes.

Then again, I would much rather prefer the moments between the Grid team than have Maya get soulful moments.

I suspect things may be revealed in 9.8

[Silktie]

I have rewatched very carefully, with everyone's theories in mind, and here's what I think.

I think there is a greater link between the Russian mafia bloke plot and the main Lucas/Albany/Chinese plot than we realised. That French assassin that Ruth had the run-in with, was in London to kill the Mafia bloke - who was bringing in 50 million Euros laundered money. But we also know that when the Chinese heard Lucas tell Vaughn that he was having problems locating the Albany file, they called and told to a French person that there was a problem. Now, this creates two possibilities:
1. The Chinese were working on their own, planning to steal the laundered money to pay for the Albany file, using the French mercenary to kill Mafia Guy. Maybe French mercenary was also there for another job, namely to kill Vaughn, Lucas and anyone else who knows about China's plans re the Alabny file.
2. The Chinese and Russians are working together to get Albany, and the Russians knew about the mafia money shipment and decided to steal it with the help of the Chinese (and the French mercenary would do the dirty work), then neither government would have to come up with the money to pay for it.

I still don't see anything from Harry that indicates to me that he is involved in this somehow. I don't think he knows anything about the real Lucas, or our Lucas being undercover in Dakar or anything like that. His distress about Lucas' betrayal rings true to me.

So if there is anything going on like Lucas being brainwashed or manipulated in some way, the only way I can see it happen is if my option 2 is correct, and it was done to him by the Russians during his time in prison there. Unfortunately for the Lucas fans, I still don't see that being the case.

Series 9.8 Spoiler: show

I believe the main question in 9.8 is not going to be whether Lucas really did all those things in Dakar, but whether he will try to redeem himself in Harry's eyes by setting up the Chinese for a fall somehow, or whether he will continue on his treacherous ways and be willing to give Albany to them if he is able to get it.

[Puppetmaster]

A rather vague idea...perhaps Lucas wants Harry on his own to try a last attempt to force Harry to give him the Albany file.