Series 10 - Episode 6 Discussion

[DogSoSmall]

Thank you Betty, that is exactly what I meant and you put it so much better, and obviously in a much less confrontational way than I had ever intended my own comment to be. I hope, Nitrus, that you accept my apology and can acknowledge that?

I have continued to post on here because I have needed to work through these emotions with people who might understand them (you think I would discuss this in any way with people I actually know? ). It does help to be able to voice the feelings. Thank you to the people who have understood, and to those who have been sympathetic even if they don't agree, and apologies again to anyone who I have inadvertently offended. The upset on here now appears to be due to misunderstanding, probably born of high emotions. Trying to clarify the misunderstanding I only seem to have made things worse. So I will bow out, but thanks for the chance to vent.

[Tineke]

Plot twists, brilliant acting, heartbreaking, very Spooks, just a few words that sum up my feelings about this last ever episode of Spooks. I thought it was a worthy end to 10 wonderful series.
That said it shocked me to see Ruth attacked by Sasha, but her following death was 'beautifully' done with the one she loved holding her. This is something that no other main character (apart from Fiona, who died in Adam's arms) had that died. It acknowledged all they were and all they had together for me. Even though those last scenes of them together were heartbreaking.
I loved the memorial wall and think it's a testament to 10 series of Spooks.
As was the last sentence Calum uttered with his questioning big blue eyes: ‘Bad people want to kill us?’ but most of all for me those last two words from Harry.

I will miss Spooks dearly.

[beatrice4ruth]

I am also so grateful that Ruth died while Harry was lovingly touching her. I just feel so sad for Harry, left adrift and back to a job he so badly wanted to quit. So stoic of him (I suppose that it is the Greek tragedy PF mentioned, not only the family Gavrik torn apart).

[novun]

Long time lurker, but first time poster. Just caught the end last night and while I pretty much knew they would do something like this (I felt the promo was a dead give away that one of them would die), I still find myself pretty put off by it all. The last few minutes were just – there are no words. This is not a knock on the actors, they were terrific with the material they were given, but the writers served the plot at the expense of the characters. Harry wouldn’t have let Ros, never mind Ruth of all people, stand between him and a gun, knife, shiv, or plastic spoon-wielding assailant. So no, that would not have happened. Also, Sasha has got to be the worst FSB officer ever to let someone as petite as Ruth get the drop on him and make him accidentally stab her (whether he was thinking straight or not, he’s a trained officer and instincts kick in). Aside from the stab wound being too low for a punctured lung, the only way Erin could have diagnosed such a thing is if she had Superman’s X-ray vision. I also didn’t like Ruth’s last words to Harry. As you lay dying, are the last words to the person you love going to be that it wasn’t meant to be? Really? She needn’t have said I love you, she could have just said his name or follow up the line by recalling the dock scene – “Harry, we weren’t meant to have those things, but it was always something wonderful” (a bit soapy perhaps, but no less so than Ros coming back to life or Harry having a Russian love child). Being the compassionate person Ruth was and knowing she was dying, I can’t believe she wouldn’t want to leave him with something kinder, more comforting.

(25-10-2011 12:27 AM)kaytea411 Wrote:  In terms of an acceptable finale -- there seems to be extreme points of view between happily ever after and death/despair/destruction.

What about the possibilities of everything in between? Certainly a mix is more fitting.

This.

(26-10-2011 10:38 AM)pennyfeather Wrote:  And at the end of the day Kudos is doing it for the big bang ending: 'How can we affect the audiences to the highest degree,

Surely that is not a fitting ending for any show...

And this.

I would have liked HR together in the end, but I wasn’t looking for a soppy, sappy ending full of weddings, kisses, babies, and rainbows. That’s not what the show is (was). However, had the writers wanted to, they certainly could have struck some kind of balance but deliberately chose not to. This show has thrived on ambiguity, gray areas, and uncertainty and they could have applied those elements to Ruth’s fate. They could have kept the final episode pretty much as is except when Harry's looking at the wall of names, hers isn’t there, but a name is being added – is it hers? Did she really die? There were other names that weren’t recognizable. Who’s to say that someone else didn’t die on some other mission? In addition, at the end when Harry answers the phone, after a beat (without the audience hearing who is on the other end), he could have given his all too familiar ironic smirk or even half a smirk. Who was on the phone? What could prompt such a reaction? Towers telling him the inquiry was over? Or could it be Ruth? Couldn’t such an ending achieved the best of the both worlds? It would have been the dramatic denouement that didn’t violate the tone of the show and kept all the resonance of the tragedy that preceded it, but if you want to squint really, really hard also gives the slightest glimmer that perhaps all is not lost.

As for poor, poor Harry (thank you Peter Firth, you were wonderful), at first, that last heartrending image of Harry still in his office answering his phone left me imagining nothing but a bleak future for him (sad, desolate, broken and bereft who will most likely take more risks in an effort to consciously/subconsciously add his name to the wall sooner rather than later, in essence, just waiting for his turn). However, this is not the lasting image I want of such a great character so despite not being a natural optimist, a part of me would like to believe that perhaps in time, (prompted by Ruth’s words of getting out while they still know who they are and his own advice to her about forming some a semblance of a life after the service) he will retire as he said. He’ll never have a cottage in Suffolk, but perhaps he could reconnect and have a relationship with his children and find some peace, some shred of happiness in that.

I’ve watched a lot of good and bad tv over the years, but considering the many ways in which this show could have ended, for me, this series finale (despite the performances) by far ranks as one of the most disappointing. Whew, thanks for letting me get that off my chest; the finale just left a really bad taste in the mouth after 10 years.

[festa]

I can abide Ruth's death. That was the best part about this show. Most tv shows you think, "they'll be ok, they can't kill a lead actor". Not Spooks! I actually predicted that either Ruth or Harry would die in the end.

But what I can not forgive is that there was no big sex scene. Unrequited love? Really? Only in the UK....

[Silktie]

Here's something that baffles me:

Why would Elena say that Harry was too decent to go through with her extraction? How is making someone a promise and then reneging on it 'decent'?

[beatrice4ruth]

(26-10-2011 04:39 PM)festa Wrote:  I can abide Ruth's death. That was the best part about this show. Most tv shows you think, "they'll be ok, they can't kill a lead actor". Not Spooks! I actually predicted that either Ruth or Harry would die in the end.

But what I can not forgive is that there was no big sex scene. Unrequited love? Really? Only in the UK....

I can deal with Ruth's death too. But no intimate scene is what shocked me the most. We had only 3 kisses, unless we pretend there was more happening between them off-screen.

Novun - Thank you for your wise words that reflect my feelings about the ending so well.

[Tranquility]

(26-10-2011 04:59 PM)beatrice4ruth Wrote:  I can deal with Ruth's death too. But no intimate scene is what shocked me the most. We had only 3 kisses, unless we pretend there was more happening between them off-screen.

Maybe there will be some in the deleted scenes on the DVD? That is of course dependent on how many bonus features they give us... we can but hope

[Beatriz]

I think Harry and Ruth were more than a love scene, from my point of view... And IMO it would have spoilt it a bit for me...

What I don't get is some comments about what should or shouldn't have happened, or whether it was fair or unfair... I know this is a show, but life is not precisely about fairness and justice...
I undertand that people can be disappointed by the ending, and that sucks, but the writers have outlayed an ending that thought fitting and that's all... Like it or not...

[harrbd]

One of the very few plus points is that for all Ilya's comtempt of Harry's life they both ended up without the woman they loved but Ilya knows that Elena was part of the plot to kill him, would have let Sasha be killed and had betrayed him for years. Harry did have the comfort that Ruth had stood by him, loved him and would have sacrificed herself for him (even if she hadn't walked into an angry Russian agent holding a dagger of glass !) Of course Ilya does have a tortoise in the garden.