Episode 1 Discussion

[Silktie]

On whether Mani would have killed the child, and Harry and Ruth anyway even if Harry had told him where the uranium was, I think it is confirmed that this is what would have happened. Mani says at the end, before pulling a knife on Ruth, that he would now do what he planned to do at the end of it all anyway. So he was definitely planning to kill them no matter what happened.

[JHyde]

Oh yeah, without a doubt. My long history of studying torture (that seems to freak a few of you out) tells me that is often the case, and corroborated by almost every action piece I've ever seen or read.

I honestly don't think Harry would have told them either way, but it's certain that Mani would have kept Ruth for last knowing that it was the ace up his sleeve. Thank God we didn't have to find out!

[Tea Lady]

Yes they would have all been killed I agree. Libby (isnt that a girls name) says on the phone to Mani that they are running out of time and that they need to get to work on the woman aka Ruth. To be honest I dont think Harry would have sat there and let that happen even if he was in handcuffs. He would have started fighting and would have preferred to have died on his feet fighting rather than sit there and watch Ruth suffer.

[Beatriz]

(09-11-2009 11:25 AM)Tea Lady Wrote:  Yes they would have all been killed I agree. Libby (isnt that a girls name) says on the phone to Mani that they are running out of time and that they need to get to work on the woman aka Ruth. To be honest I dont think Harry would have sat there and let that happen even if he was in handcuffs. He would have started fighting and would have preferred to have died on his feet fighting rather than sit there and watch Ruth suffer.

Surely, we would have watched Harry in action again; if he reacted kicking the laptop when George was killed, imagine what he would do with Ruth in danger

[HellsBells]

They would have had to kill Harry and Ruth otherwise everyone would know they had the uranium.

[almh]

(09-11-2009 11:17 AM)JHyde Wrote:  Oh yeah, without a doubt. My long history of studying torture (that seems to freak a few of you out) tells me that is often the case, and corroborated by almost every action piece I've ever seen or read.

You wonder why we're slightly freaked out??? But I do think that whatever happened, Mani was going to kill Ruth. He only needed Harry, and Ruth was just there to get Harry to talk. If he did talk, they would have both died. If he didn't, only Ruth would have died (Kind of harsh on Ruth I feel )

[JHyde]

Just to clarify: I am not some sadistic weirdo. I just wrote an essay on torture and how effective it is or isn't for a human rights society in Australia, and part of that meant reading about the development of torture techniques and how governments and intelligence communities condone them. Which means I know lots of weird stuff. It was earlier in the thread.

To get back on thread - Harry also knew the best case scenario in this situation is to stall for time, which he does on several occasions. But I do think it's a big tell that when he and Ruth are left alone he doesn't brief her, and explain what methods will be used and what they should do, as he would have done with anyone else. He wants to talk and her and her new life. He wants to postpone the bad stuff for as long as possible.

[almh]

Awww, that line is a really good way to put it. He definitely doesn't want the bad stuff to happen to Ruth - he wants to keep her safe, (as he does his team,) but he can't.

[JHyde]

See? I have a heart! Like Harry!

[Tea Lady]

Thats a good point JHyde. He does play for time and has probably been trained to do that. He doesnt tell Ruth she has named the wrong place which wastes time, killing George wastes time (unfortunately for Ruth) Kicking the laptop wastes time, and letting Mani count down to kill the boy again wastes time when Harry still says he wont tell him where the uranium is. The longer they stayed alive the more chance they would be rescued.